Flex questions

I was curious what is the appropriate amount of room to have for a trail rig? I know plenty of travel is needed up and down. I know there are several things that would change it like tire size and vechicle ect. Maybe the proper question is how much is needed to make a well rounded trail rig?

I have been staring at the jeep today and trying to figure out the clearance and flex room it has. Planning to break out a tape measure tomorrow when I get the chance.






I tried to take some pics to show what clear I had normal. When I get do some off roading that will show some flex I will take some more. I was real worried about having the tires in the fender but I think I have alot more room than I thought.

94Blazer327 wrote: Its about tire size,wheel base,gearing, H/P, and how much skinny youll give it.

Most of that isn't changing lol. I will have a new set of tires for wheeling before too long. Gearing will come next winter and I'm learning about the skinny petal . The long term goal is for creeping over terrain. If I stick with the 4.0 I'm sure I'll be paying atlas a visit and looking at several lockers and axle regearing. Need to secure the wagoner I found first though.

94Blazer327 wrote: Im not tring to sound like a 'smart arshe' but I think youre over thinking it a little. Creeping around is fine and dandy when its dry as a powder house but when its slicker than owl snot youre gonna have to throw the coals to it....... at least if you expect to get up the 'rock' . I wouldnt really worry too much about flex as long as the tires arent taking the fenders out

You're right about needing the getty up. I'm pretty satisfied with the 4.0 so far though it handles the 35's with no problem at every speed I've ran them. I just assued it would be there if I needed it. No smart ass about it man! Call it constructive abuse lol. I ask things like this because I don't know and I don't think about things you experienced offroaders do.

alabamatoy wrote: Flex is more about droop than compression.  I think my 4runner "flexes" pretty well....it will almost score 1000 on Jeremy's ramp.  But it only has about 3" or so of compression in the front suspension before it hits the bumpstops.  Skinny pedal with a 22RE is sorta like beating a borrowed mule.....its going to work at its own pace regardless of how hard you push it.   BTW, for the new guys, RCRC does have an RTI ramp, as documented here.  The RTI ramp is a good way to look at what is actually limiting your flex, and sometimes that turns out to be something you wouldnt otherwise expect.....like shocks, or brake lines.

The page you are looking for might have been removed, had its name changed, or is temporarily unavailable.

I was considering the forklift test after I get the bump stops but that would be better for the tj probably. My shocks are dead so they are one of the next things I am going to buy at rocket city off road. Just gotta talk Danny into telling me what I need

mdmTJ wrote: alabamatoy wrote: ...BTW, for the new guys, RCRC does have an RTI ramp, as documented here.  The RTI ramp is a good way to look at what is actually limiting your flex, and sometimes that turns out to be something you wouldnt otherwise expect.....like shocks, or brake lines. I've got it at my house.

In my neck of the woods too !

Very nice ! I gotta go back and try the other links again now lol

bluetoy wrote: I think flex is way over rated and a lot is not neccassary for a well functioning trail rig. I've argued this topic before on here and several other boards and I'm definately the minority on this. So therefore I will not elaborate on the matter. As for your Jeep, I would leave it exactly like it is but buy some good tires, lockers F/R, and wheel the crap out of it.   However, if you want you can read through this thread from a couple of years ago. Some of it will apply to your jeep, most of it will not. suspension_discussion_thread

Reading it now thanks man

bluetoy wrote: I think flex is way over rated and a lot is not neccassary for a well functioning trail rig. I've argued this topic before on here and several other boards and I'm definately the minority on this. So therefore I will not elaborate on the matter. As for your Jeep, I would leave it exactly like it is but buy some good tires, lockers F/R, and wheel the crap out of it.   However, if you want you can read through this thread from a couple of years ago. Some of it will apply to your jeep, most of it will not. suspension_discussion_thread

Well seem to have to have a balance between stiffness and flex. Lol just wished I knew when it was.

Side note I'm bored and off road because the weather. I'm gonna see what is around the house to test the tj on. might end up using a jack under the tire buuuut I'll work out something. Anyone free in case I jack it too high?

Just find a business with a loading ramp.  Here's a fellow xterra club member at his shop.  That's how they get a "test flex" without using the forklift.

mdmTJ wrote: alabamatoy wrote: ...BTW, for the new guys, RCRC does have an RTI ramp, as documented here.  The RTI ramp is a good way to look at what is actually limiting your flex, and sometimes that turns out to be something you wouldnt otherwise expect.....like shocks, or brake lines. I've got it at my house.

Flex can be good in certain situations,but not necessary to go up most obstacles.H/P isn't needed if your rig hooks up.Countless times I have followed buggies/jeeps with  44's with seemingly unless H/P and have crawled what was their launching pad.I can count on 1 hand how many times H/P has played a factor. Learn your rig and you can more places than you think. Don't waste a bunch of money on crap that more than likely is gonna be replaced 1 year down the road.I you want to "creep" get gears and lockers, pick the tire size you want and put suitable axles for them. Go with the minimum lift needed for the job.IMO if you do alot of RCRC rides 33's and maybe a locker is all u need anyway. 

Edited by yotabj - 18 February 2009 at 6:23am

I think its important to remember that what would be gospel for a 38"+tire trail only rig, probably isnt going to work well with a smaller tire daily driver.  I think everyones needs are different and everyone has to go through there own trial and error to find out what works and doesnt.

we got a ramp at the office. I just wanted it to be alittle more controlled so I could see it. Hell I'll give it a try first chance I get. 

RL-RRC wrote: I think its important to remember that what would be gospel for a 38"+tire trail only rig, probably isnt going to work well with a smaller tire daily driver.  I think everyones needs are different and everyone has to go through there own trial and error to find out what works and doesnt.

As he stated in the first post"trail rig" is what he was questioning.All terrains and 37" or smaller tires aren't normally found on "trail" rigs.Kinda hard to call a real trail rig a daily driver. Why spend time and money on proven bad setups for what you are wanting to do? Same the 63" chevy springs they accomplish the flex you want, but hang on everything on the trail.Weigh the pros and cons.I just don't see the point on wasting money on axles/tires/susp. if you are planning on going bigger a year or so down the road. No offense Alabamatoy but really RCRC really don't do any hard trails.I know I have been on several rides with ya'll and there is a select few that actually hit the big stuff.The majority just trail ride.

D60's!!!!!!!!!! LOL

Edited by 94Blazer327 - 18 February 2009 at 7:47am

yotabj wrote: RL-RRC wrote: I think its important to remember that what would be gospel for a 38"+tire trail only rig, probably isnt going to work well with a smaller tire daily driver.  I think everyones needs are different and everyone has to go through there own trial and error to find out what works and doesnt. As he stated in the first post"trail rig" is what he was questioning.All terrains and 37" or smaller tires aren't normally found on "trail" rigs.Kinda hard to call a real trail rig a daily driver. Why spend time and money on proven bad setups for what you are wanting to do? Same the 63" chevy springs they accomplish the flex you want, but hang on everything on the trail.Weigh the pros and cons.I just don't see the point on wasting money on axles/tires/susp. if you are planning on going bigger a year or so down the road. No offense Alabamatoy but really RCRC really don't do any hard trails.I know I have been on several rides with ya'll and there is a select few that actually hit the big stuff.The majority just trail ride.

bluetoy wrote: Yes, jeeps are junk. I totally agree.

Edited by 94Blazer327 - 18 February 2009 at 8:25am

if you know how to wheel your stock axles will hold with lockers and gears.

i run stock shafts detroits and 4.56s on 35s and i am not afraid to take it anywhere. whats the worst thats gonna happen. you break, then fix, or you have to winch. its all part of it

My drivetrain is completely stock with 4.6 gearing and turning 33's without problems although I'm considering a set of crawler gears and plan to have an air-locker by 2010.  The non-supercharged xterras have 4.9's and I know several guys turning 35's without any problems other than horrific gas mileage.  And all of our rigs are powered by a measly 3.3L.  The 2nd gen xterras are the first with a 4.0L in them and they are having issues grenading diffs left and right.

[/QUOTE]My truck has been driven to tellico 5 times there and back and wheeled hard everytime. I agree with you beliefs on tread lightly etc. I have picked my share of trash. I guess you missed my point, I am just saying why buy a kit for the running gear you have ,if you are gonna change it all when he gets the cash for upgrades that don't work with kit he is looking into now without a ton of fab. work. Back on topic.

I think we should have another RTI ramp party not because it proves anything but because its just fun to get together and BS.

Well as a dd rig that gets around 10 mpg with 3.73s I won't regear it until I have something else. 

Tex62 wrote: bluetoy wrote: Tex62 wrote: Lol you are right I know. But I hate to put lockers or gears in a stock jeep axle. I need another set of tires but I'm putting it off until I know what I want for tires   Again, how many times have you wheeled that jeep? It appears you have spent too much time web wheeling and not enough time on the trail.   Yes, jeep axles are junk. I totally agree.    But.... plenty of people wheel them with good luck. As long as you keep the tire size moderate they'll be fine. I highly doubt you'll be hitting the most hardcore trails for a long time anyways .   You shouldn't be even considering motor swaps and $4K suspension setups with a rig that has open diffs in both ends and all terrains. Again, gears, lockers in BOTH ends, and good tires will be the best mods you can do to gain performance. You can probably buy all of this cheaper than a motor swap or high dollar lift.   So for now, get out on the trail and learn what your jeep will do with what you have. Then upgrade as neccassary.   I'm not trying to be a turd, just giving you some constructive criticism. NP man not taking offense at all. I've been a handful of times but nothing real serious. Worst thing I've done so far was the trip to the property. And it did surprise me there. Not really worried about motor swaps at this point I'm pleased with the 4.0. I just have this building urge. I wanna build things. Was plotting the lift because I was thinking long term goals but Like usual I decided it was over kill . Pretty much stuck I keep having to work on days that there are rides. I'm not too fond of night rides either because I'm blind lol. one of these days though

Hey man, I don't want you to feel like we are all busting your balls here, but if you've only ridden up to the property and back and were surprised it what you could do then you need to do a lot more wheeling before you get a lift.  I've seen bone stock, long wheel base, long bed, IFS, toyota pickups with stock street tires drive up that side...(I think his name was monty, he used to post here a lot?)

My point is, before you drop massive amounts of cash you need to wheel the piss out of what you got.  If you live in the Madison area and want to come by my house for some chit chat/ tech/ bs /advice/ BEER shoot me a PM.  I've got the bone stock jeep sittin in the backyard and I can show you pictures and video of places its been that will blow your mind.  I've also got my RE equipped rubicon if you want to take a look at some of the problems I've encountered with it.

I really hope you give me a holler and come on by cuz you could benefit from my experiences.  I have been in your exact position and could really give you some money saving tips.  You bring your Jeep and I'll provide the beer!


Edited by Case - 19 February 2009 at 2:26am

Let me know when ya'll do your jeep/beer fun day. I'd be more than happy to bring my jeep and some additional beer.

Beer and bs is always nice! Just need a place to do it